Front suspension, tie-bars

[gouldsborough7]

I was jacking-up my car to sort out various things underneath, like engine mountings and exhaust, and by chance noticed that one of the tie-bar nuts was seriously loose!

So looked in Haynes (Cortina) Manual, and apart from a few measurements of 2 degrees (if you had some fancy kit on which to apply this), and what-ifs, then there was no clear way of putting things right. I tightened up the offending nut on a temporary basis, with the intent on getting the adjustments all sorted out properly.

I am a bit reluctant to entrust my car to an expensive geometry checking garage, but unlike toe-in/out measurements, Caster Angle is a different animal to tame!

Anybody got any user-friendly ideas?
Cheers
Mike

[Dane_Rescueman]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

I rebuilt my fron suspension a while back. The only way to set up the bars is with a gauge. Europa do a cheap one which has worked OK.
I suppose you could try and set the nuts to the marks left on the threads over the years .
Before I fitted superflex bushes my car almost failed MoT for those tie bar nuts which did seem to work loose at the time. (He let me attack them with an adjustable during the test - nice bloke!)

[j.fernie]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Mike,
I,ve just replaced my bushes to get through the MOT. (The bushes came from South Wales Propshafts, cost a tenner incl. postage and arrived the next day). The inner tie-bar nut clearly hasn't been moved for years and doesn't look as if it will, so I have done as Dane suggests and put them back where they were. Seems to have worked so far as there is no obvious uneven tyre wear.
I wonder if the kit can be hired? As I'm based just down the road from you we could look at doing both cars - 2 for the price of 1!

[csjcarolyn]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Hi Mike,
The way to do this is to measure the wheel base [the distance between the contact patch of the front and rear wheels - the lowest point of your trye where it meets the road] and shorten or lengthen the tie bars accordingly.

The length of thw wheel base for the Berlinetta is 108.5" [275.59cm].

When you have adjusted and tightened the lock nuts you will need to road test so everything settles into place and then check / adjust / road test again until correct.

When tightening the tie bar nuts turn each nut towards each other the same number of turns so the wheel base adjustment is not lost.

Hope this is clear and helpful.

Roger

[gouldsborough7]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Thanks Roger, I'll give the wheelbase measuring idea a try.

Jim, I was hoping there was another Berlinetta owner near me. If you might be interested in meeting up, you could e-mail me on [email protected] to discuss further.
Cheers
Mike

[gouldsborough7]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Just getting around to carrying out the checks on wheelbase. Thought I would start by buying some new rubber bushes, so got a pair off e-Bay see attached 1st photo.

On looking closely at existing bushes on car, it was obvious that the design is different, with a sandwich arrangement between big washers - see 2nd photo.

Has anyone an idea on what model is fitted to my car, and where I can get replacements? Presumably, there is a torque setting or similar, so that the bushes don't get over or under-tightened?
Cheers
Mike

[macdonald.dm]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Hi Mike.

What year Cortina is yours based on? Mine is 1975 Mk3, and needed these: 130135542127 on Ebay (as an example). You'll also find Polyurethane bushes being sold on there which, obviously, cost quite a bit more!

Have a look at your car and see if there is a nut>dished washer>bush>dished washer>chassis>dished washer>bush>dished washer>nut set-up!

Don't ask me why they are different colours - I guess one goes on the inside and one on the out (I SHOULD know, 'cos I did this job last year, but senility is a terrible thing...) I'm trying to remember if the old bushes which came off were also two colours?

You'll find a 'crush tube' - a metal sleeve - under the existing bushes, and the nut is simply tightened until the bushes are compressed until the metal washers make contact with this tube - job done.

I seem to remember getting the tie bars out was quite a juggling act, involving lots of repeated lock-to-lock steering movements and turning of the rod itself. I didn't want to move the inner nut on the rod, so that the setting wouldn't be altered. Obviously, if you slacken the inner nut too, the bar will be easier to remove/refit.

[gouldsborough7]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Hi Donnie
Sounds like your car and mine are of similar Cortina design, except mine is 1981. The combination of washers and bushes sounds about right. I'll check out e-Bay and see if I can make any progress. Don't know what was supplied to me previously, but I think it was supposed to be for a Cortina. Whether I have any redress on the supplier, I don't know. For the sake of a tenner (inc postage), it is probably not worth the aggro.
Thanks for your trouble
Cheers
Mike

[macdonald.dm]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Hi Mike.

I've just had another look through my Haynes manual, and the exploded diagram of the front suspension shows the front tie bar bushes to be 'cone'-shaped, very similar to yours except that they appear to be in two different pieces, not single like the one in your photo.

Further on in the chapter - when it actually covers the replacement task - the close-up diagram clearly shows them as being the 'doughnut'-shaped bushes, and the caption says 'July 1973 onwards'. I guess, then, that the rubber ones you received WERE Cortina, but only pre-'73 (although still suitable for some Mk3 models)?

If this is the case, there's no harm in contacting the supplier. Obviously it'll cost you return postage - and he'll keep the original outward postage costs as well - but it's better than having a couple of bits of rubber sitting on your shelf gathering dust...

Unless, a pre-73 owner on here needs bushes?!

[gouldsborough7]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Hi Donnie
After my last entry, I couldn't find the same supplier on e-Bay, and I've mislaid the paperwork involved. On reflction the cost was only about £2 + postage, so no big deal. However, another source had pics of the same 'waisted' rubbers, and were labelled as front Stabiliser Bushes for Cortina Mk.3,4,5 in a pack of 4. Could these be Ford anti-roll-bar bushes, with 2 on either end of the roll-bar? Obviously no use to me if so. Anyway, I might find a use for them e.g. sliding over blunt end of a metal chisel or other tool.
Cheers
Mike

[danny_nelson]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Mike you have answered your own question. The bushes you have are for the stabilizer bar not the Tie bar. I know of several Berlinettas that were built to accept the stabilizer bar, but most followed the build instructions and did not use.

[danny_nelson]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Mike you have answered your own question. The bushes you have are for the stabilizer bar not the Tie bar. I know of several Berlinettas that were built to accept the stabilizer bar, but most followed the build instructions and did not use.

[gouldsborough7]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

I've bought a set of bushes, and as Donnie said they come in 2 x white and 2 x black colours. I guess reason is that one colour is harder than the other.

Anyone know for sure which way around they should be? - black at the front, or white?

I'll will have a hunt to see if Haynes produces any clues, but no prizes for guessing the likely outcome. (Hope I don't have to eat my words!)

Cheers
Mike

[macdonald.dm]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Hi Mike.

As you suspect, the Haynes manual makes no reference to two colours!

Ok, take this with the requisite pinch of salt, but I don't remember being too confused when replacing mine last year, so can only speculate that the old ones must also have had some remnant of colour in them to guide me. I fitted mine with the black bush on the out/front side. I must have had some indication from somewhere that this was the way to do it (perhaps I contacted the supplier? Really, this senility is becoming a hassle...) because I simply wouldn't have proceeded with the job if I hadn't some indication which way round to fit them!

Now, I fully expect to be told that I have them the wrong way round!* So, please double-confirm with someone who knows FOR CERTAIN before proceeding!


*And I ain't changing them!

[macdonald.dm]

Re: Front suspension, tie-bars

Hi again Mike.

I've just looked at your photo above, and the INSIDE bush on yours looks black!

So, definitely get proper confirmation before proceeding (ie: ignore me...)