Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

[gary.price]

My car passed the mot today but the tester said ther was alot of play in the nearside front tie rod ball joint and yes the arm moves up and down alot at the rack end. Is ther anywhere i get a new balljoint? is it a rack out job?

My car is marina based.

Thanks steven.

[stevejgreen]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

It's a busy week this week!

The problem is that a bush inside the steering rack fails and needs replacement.
The method is outlined on page 2 of http://www.fastmarinamagazine.com/in...hp&f=13&t=5676

The bushes were recently sourced by Marinacoupe (who posted on that thread) he may still have some bushes in stock. He also has an article published on his own website http://www.marinacoupe.co.uk/

Unfortunately, it's a rack out job, and that involves quite a bit of body dismantling as its the first thing fitted when the cars are built.

Donsayers on here at http://www.marlinownersclub.com/foru...-rack-MOT-fail went through the excercise.

Recon racks appear on eBay from £30 to £80. Only Marina racks will fit, there are no alternatives.

Perhaps I should do my own combined version on keepandshare!

Copies of an early Marina Workshop manual steering section are available at http://www.keepandshare.com/doc/4204...1-pm-637k?da=y

[gary.price]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

Oh blimey. do mk1 and mk2 racks fit into eachothers places?
Iv had a stroke and cant do to much like i used to, just bolt on bolt off.

Thanks.

[gary.price]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

What a pain this is gonna be

[stevejgreen]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

As far as I know the difference beteen a MK1 and MK2 rack is in the mounting bush arrangement at either end. I think it is significant on a Marina but not so on a Marlin. Perhaps someone else with Marina Roadster experience can confirm my suspicions.

Donsayers might be along in a bit and detail the work necessary.

[CABRIOBOB]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

The Mk1 mounts are the same as a Mk2 but I think the tie rods are about 1" longer on each side, just cut them down and add extra thread.

[gary.price]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

Hi thanks, so is ther a mesurment for mk1 and mk2 racks so i can find out which 1 iv got.

[stevejgreen]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

I am not so sure that Bob is correct, without better evidence. We differ in that I understand it is the mounts, and Bob the length.

I have what, was purchased from a local Motor Factor as decribed as a rebuilt MK2 Marina Rack that is 40 1/2" end to end.
The two ends look like this.



and



If you would like any further measurments of the rack shown, I can provide them.

Can anyone else provide some supporting pictures/dimensions?

[b_caswell]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

Have a look at this site http://www.cjw-consulting.co.uk/stee...ering_rack.htm Manual pic 3 says 47.3 inches ball joint to ball joint.

[stevejgreen]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

Thanks Ben but that's the same source and person as www.Marinacoupe.co.uk that I linked to on my first post.

Otherwise known as c.weedon on this forum and marinacoupe on fastmarina or cjwconsulting.

Chris's dimension adds another variable, the ball joints.

Chris has stock of the rack bushes but it sounds as if a replacement rack is on the cards, so I wanted to clear up the specific differences if any.


What I have found is a smaller pic of what is apparently a Mk1 Marina rack.



Although a little small you can see two rings/flanges where the mountings fit on both ends of the rack.

The pictures that I posted easler show the MK2 rack with ring/flange on the steering column side only, the other end being comparatively plain.

This I believe is the only difference unless someone can provide further evidence.

[greyV8pete]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

The Mk1 mounts are the same as a Mk2 but I think the tie rods are about 1" longer on each side, just cut them down and add extra thread.

Take care before cutting and rethreading a tie rod. I think you will find that tie rod threads have the same minor (bottom of the thread) diameter the same as the tie rod itself, so the thread overall diameter is larger than the tie rod diameter. The thread will also be hi tensile type, i.e. it's a rolled thread. Cutting shorter and trying to re-thread may therefore not be possible and at the very least will almost certainly raise undesirable stress issues on such a safety critical part. Peter.

[gary.price]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

Thanks peeps.

So steve do you think the over rack could be made to fit easily? Ill try and compare mine to your photos as ther might not be a problem.

[stevejgreen]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

Take care before cutting and rethreading a tie rod. I think you will find that tie rod threads have the same minor (bottom of the thread) diameter the same as the tie rod itself, so the thread overall diameter is larger than the tie rod diameter. The thread will also be hi tensile type, i.e. it's a rolled thread. Cutting shorter and trying to re-thread may therefore not be possible and at the very least will almost certainly raise undesirable stress issues on such a safety critical part. Peter.

Have to agree, cutting a thread is not an option because, as described, the thread is rolled.

[gary.price]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

I wasnt planning on cutting the track rods. to much skill required.

I think iv found some measurements

Rack, rcond, exch rack, R-H drive, Marina MK1 to 1975 (length 40.5”)

Rack, rcond, exch rack, R-H drive, Marina MK2 & Ita, 1975 on (length 40.25”)


So is the difference gonna be enough to worry about. As in will it adjust out?
How can i get over the different mountings?

Sorry for the daft questions.

[stevejgreen]

Re: Mot pass, but excessive play in steering rack ball joint.

Thanks peeps.

So steve do you think the over rack could be made to fit easily? Ill try and compare mine to your photos as ther might not be a problem.

My evidence is that the racks are the same length whether Mk1 or Mk2 and it is only the mounting flanges or lack of them that is the difference.

So my advice would be to source a recon rack, (marinacoupe has some) or
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/STEERING-R...item2eba979e05 or
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MORRIS-MAR...item3a77dc956d or
anywhere else for that matter.

The mounting bushes might be a bit tired, replacements are the same as a Triumph Dolomite http://www.rimmerbros.co.uk/Item--i-139386

Getting the rack out will mean a fair bit of dismantling, but nothing heavy or needing special tools apart from a taper breaker.
The car will need tracking checked afterwards but some careful measurements will have it close enough to drive to a garage.

I am confident that this is good accurate advice.

A copy of the relevant section for a Marina is at

http://www.keepandshare.com/doc/4204876/19-steering-pdf-june-26-2012-2-31-pm-637k?da=y