Where do I go from here ??

[keith_h]

Many of you are aware that I have been trying to organise the C2C The Great Smokie run and today I received the following email.


**********************

Dear Keith,
I write on behalf of the committee of the Marlin Owner's Club.

Following our recent committee meeting we respectfully request that you kindly cease to use the Marlin Owner's Club logo or other references to the Marlin Owner's Club in communications and documentation associated with your C2C Coast-to-Coast event.

Despite use of Owner's Club facilities in promoting the run and the involvement of members of Marlin Owner's Club as individuals the event is in all other respects both privately organised and in the public domain.

Following advice subsequent to the inclusion of the current design of promotion material appearing in Pitstop we consider that your documents should not suggest any formal association between the Owner's Club, a particular charity or the event itself and that further communications from you should be amended from this point onwards.

The committee do however wish you all success in fund-raising for a worthwhile cause which we fully appreciate is of major personal importance to youself.

Yours,
John Mulvaney,
vice-chair, Marlin Owner's Club

****************************

My initial reaction was shut the whole thing down, get in touch with the dignitaries and turn them off and wash my hands of the club and raise a few issues in retaliation but then I thought about it and I tried to get my head around what is behind this demand. I can only assume it is because I have chosen the charity Parkinsons UK because I have Parkinsons and it is somehow perceived by the committee that I am running the event for my own personal benefit. I wonder if the same reaction would have come about if I had chosen Cancer Research. The interesting thing is that I can no longer use the Club’s name in all the press releases I had lined up to promote the Club. ie local TV and radio and Kit Car magazines , all of whom gave us positive coverage for LeJoG. So, what do I do? I cannot write letters or send out emails without the ability to refer to the group of volunteers with some collective name. Imagine how much money would be raised by the likes of Children in Need if companies were not allowed to mention their name when handing over the cash. That raises another issue. Let's assume for the moment that we are reasonably successful and raise a quantity of funds, what name do I put on the online donation site? I am going to dwell on it for a week but in the mean time I am asking the members to suggest how I should carry on with the project.

Just out of interst the email says "following advice". Whose advice was that? I have no problem in folllowing alterantive suggestions. For someone to say we would rather you didn't do that but we suggest you do it this way instead is a far more acceptable approach.

[andyf]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

Hi Keith, I can only assume that it's because of the risk of being liable if something were to go wrong. I know that Craven is a limited company for that reason.

[David]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

Seems a bit off to get that via email, a call would have been better to explain reasons, especially as you announced it on the forums a while back and no-one objected at the time.

As a returning member this rings alarm bells!

[dcunn]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

David, the alarm bells we at committee heard were the ones caused by seeing the promo literature which put the MOC logo and the charity
logo on the same page....as Andyf says our concern is for the Club's potential liability as perception might be that it is an official Club event.

John's email on behalf of the committee was an attempt to point that out - the endeavour by members of the Club to raise money for a very
worthwhile charity is to be applauded and we wish everyone well for a successful run - there was/is no intention of trying to curtail it.

There has never been(and never will be)any suggestion at all that KH is doing this for his own personal benefit

Hope this helps. Rgds DC

[David]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

I don't want to create too many waves here (as the new boy with no prior history with this kind of issue!) but Keith's post of the mid December asks for the committee's support and the Chairman appears to give it.

http://www.marlinownersclub.com/forum/showthread.php?5588-Drivers-wanted-for-East-to-West-relay-event-the-weekend-of-May-29th-30th-and-31st&p=31654#post31654

There's nothing in the Club Constitution or Code of Conduct about use of the logo save for the latter '2. Misconduct' that states 'a) unauthorised use of club information including club logo' but given the Club's Chairman apparent support in that thread that could be seen as an authorisation.

If this is a technical matter, for example someone only just realised that there would be a liability issue, then the committee's support in resolving the issue to their satisfaction and the dozen or so members who have offered their time and cars for the of the event would be a less confrontational way forward.

Can I suggest that if the Club doesn't want to run the event then the wording could be changed to 'in association with Marlin Owners Club members' or something like that.

I'm just trying to help here. I would have thought the last thing we want to do is discourage fund raising for good causes if only because it does raise the profile of the marque.

Kind Regards,

David.

[keith_h]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

I am somewhat confused. Before I started to organize this event I asked for and received the Clubs blessing to go ahead. Under the thread title of : An open letter to the committee re an east - west relay In that thread I described the event and asked: I would ask the committee for it's backing to carry arrange such a relay. I closed the thread with the paragraph: So, can I have the committee's blessing to get on with the project and can I call for drivers who would be prepared to drive one of the legs I got this response from the chairman of the Club : The committee is more than happy for ANY members to organise an event. We wish you luck with it and hope that members support it. In my book that makes it an official Club event – I asked for permission to run it and received it. I would appreciate it if I could see the minutes of the committee meeting that John eludes to so that I can respond to the actual discussion and the issues raised

[stevejgreen]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

I am somewhat confused. Before I started to organize this event I asked for and received the Clubs blessing to go ahead. Under the thread title of : An open letter to the committee re an east - west relay In that thread I described the event and asked: I would ask the committee for it's backing to carry arrange such a relay. I closed the thread with the paragraph: So, can I have the committee's blessing to get on with the project and can I call for drivers who would be prepared to drive one of the legs I got this response from the chairman of the Club : The committee is more than happy for ANY members to organise an event. We wish you luck with it and hope that members support it. In my book that makes it an official Club event – I asked for permission to run it and received it. I would appreciate it if I could see the minutes of the committee meeting that John eludes to so that I can respond to the actual discussion and the issues raised

Could not agree more. Keith's plan is published in Pitstop as well.
The Committee supported, and some past and present Committee members took part in Keith's last great successful venture, LeJog, under full support of the then Committee, I presume. What has changed significantly since?

I doubt we will have sight of the minutes until they are approved, at the next committee meeting in May, unless I have my calculations wrong. It would have been nice if Keith had known that his project was under investigation, before the committee meeting took place. It might have afforded some timely discussion and change in planning at an early stage, rather than when Keith is starting to dot the i's and cross the tee's.

[Mike]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

Guys

Don't make a big issue out of this.

The committee may not have handled this very well, but they are doing their best (no one is perfect) and they have a legitimate concern that any event like this could leave the club open to litigation, however slight the risk. So belatedly, and rather clumisly, they have put out a memo clearing the club of any legal responsibility.

Keith has gone to a lot of effort to organise this, and should continue with it. It is being organised and run by members of the MOC club, but not by the club itself.

Please do not make this an issue: carry on as you were.

Sometimes you have to listen to the message and ignore the words.


Keith
You still have my support for what will be a fun event, and for a very worthwhile cause - I watched my mother suffer from Parkinsons for 35 years, so anyone helping to raise funds will get my full support.

Mike

[listerjp2]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

Hi Mike

I agree, as one of the drivers on the LeJog run I can whole heartedly recommend the experience.

Keep up the good work Keith and I look forward to hearing the progress and hopefully seeing the pictures.

Unfortunately I had to sell the old banger so sadly I won't be able to attend but I offer my services as support along the way.

Adrian

Guys

Don't make a big issue out of this.

The committee may not have handled this very well, but they are doing their best (no none is perfect) and they have a legitimate concern that any event like this could leave the club open to litigation, however slight the risk. So belatedly and rather clumisly they have put out a memo clearing the club of any legal responsibility.

Keith has gone to a lot of effort to organise this, and should continue with it. It is being organised and run by members of the MOC club, but not by the club itself.

Please do not make this an issue: carry on as you were.

Sometimes you have to listen to the message and ignore the words.


Keith
You still have my support for what will be a fun event, and for a very worthwhile cause - I watched my mother suffer from Parkinsons for 35 years, so anyone helping to raise funds will get my full support.

Mike

[keith_h]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

Hi Keith, I can only assume that it's because of the risk of being liable if something were to go wrong. I know that Craven is a limited company for that reason.

Hello Andy, If it is a question of liability, that would paint an unpleasant picture in that it would give the impression that the committee is happy for me to organise something for the enjoyment of members but if something went wrong they would be more than happy to 'leave me out to dry'. Nice. That is precisely why I asked permission to run the event and get the OK before I embarked upon organising it.

[andyf]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

Hello Andy, If it is a question of liability, that would paint an unpleasant picture in that it would give the impression that the committee is happy for me to organise something for the enjoyment of members but if something went wrong they would be more than happy to 'leave me out to dry'. Nice. That is precisely why I asked permission to run the event and get the OK before I embarked upon organising it.

As has been said before they have not delt with this very well. I would be interested to understand what the risk is that they are worried about. Anyway you have my support.

[davidmartin720]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

I seem to be confused by the e-mail from the Marlin Owners Club Committee to Keith Howell. The Club supported The Great Pasty Relay [of which I took part], I know a lot of the organising for both events, was undertaken by Keith. Was the Pasty Run the MOC's idea, looking at the Recipes, Certificates and the banners on the cars,[copies to hand], they all had Owners Marlin Club on them, and the donation webpage was http:/www.justgiving.com/MarlinOwnersClub. I, like Keith, would have thought the original answer to Keith was approval for the CtC, to list it as a forthcoming event in the Pitstop and to publish a large write-up to me conveys approval. When the CtC is listed next to Scottish Weekend, Suffolk Weekend and Marlins in the Marches all for Marlin Owners Club members to attend, I fail to see the difference. What other events have realised as much Forum time!!!!! I do not want to see another "blip" in the MOC like a few years ago, I realise everybody gives their time voluntarily, and the Committee do a good job, but what is the difference????? David.

[andyf]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

I seem to be confused by the e-mail from the Marlin Owners Club Committee to Keith Howell. The Club supported The Great Pasty Relay [of which I took part], I know a lot of the organising for both events, was undertaken by Keith. Was the Pasty Run the MOC's idea, looking at the Recipes, Certificates and the banners on the cars,[copies to hand], they all had Owners Marlin Club on them, and the donation webpage was http:/www.justgiving.com/MarlinOwnersClub. I, like Keith, would have thought the original answer to Keith was approval for the CtC, to list it as a forthcoming event in the Pitstop and to publish a large write-up to me conveys approval. When the CtC is listed next to Scottish Weekend, Suffolk Weekend and Marlins in the Marches all for Marlin Owners Club members to attend, I fail to see the difference. What other events have realised as much Forum time!!!!! I do not want to see another "blip" in the MOC like a few years ago, I realise everybody gives their time voluntarily, and the Committee do a good job, but what is the difference????? David.

I can't see what the problem can be which is why I would like someone from the committee to give us an explanation.

[CosworthCabrioLee]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

Hi all, having just read the various post on this subject can I add my thoughts, as the ex moc chairman and ex member I like to keep up to date with moc goings ons. I really think this has been handled badly by the committee but imagine the person instigating this will be the vice chairman. What happened when I ran the moc lakes invasion for 10 years, or Liz and Doug ran the moc derbishire event or various volunteers who have used the club name for over 30 yeaRs
What a crock of shit, and just another instance of the dinosaur's running the club. This was the reason I left the club and many others have too.
2 pieces of advice
1, Keith run the event for the members have fun and raise loads of money for a worth while charity
2, The immediate resignation of the committee to allow a new committee to be formed and perhaps the club will survive, and move on,

[Dane_Rescueman]

Re: Where do I go from here ??

So, the run is being organised by "club members" not "the club" itself. The Members are the club. I assume that "the club" means the committee which appears to be a separate entity from us lowly members.
i've just finished working for part of the NHS where concentrated bureaucracy is the daily norm; affecting every tiny part of the work. I didn't expect to find this in the MOC following the turmoil experienced in the club a few years ago with terrible infighting amongst committee members and some ordinary club members resulting in schism.
I take my Marlin to at least four charity car shows in Cornwall each year. It is in the programme as a Marlin, it has Marlin badges on it, it has Marlin owners club on a badge bar and window stickers. I have always put a notice up showing the history of the car and info about the MOC.
It looks like I may have been breaking some heinous law.
Well, I'll maybe have to stop and join a local club instead who are not feared of proudly promoting their cars.
Poor Keith. I don't know what to say after all the work you have done for us all. It all seems a bit spineless for the club to distance itself from your endeavours.
Lee, as I was tempted to do when you left the club, the time may be ripe to follow.